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Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. [message #1436 is a reply to message #1430]

Wed, 08 February 2006 15:57

Hubertus Franke
Messages: 16
Registered: February 2006

Junior Member

Kirill Korotaev wrote:
>>> Eric W. Biederman wrote:
>>> So it seems the clone( flags ) is a reasonable approach to create new
>>> namespaces. Question is what is the initial state of each namespace?
>>> In pidspace we know we should be creating an empty pidmap !
>>> In network, someone suggested creating a loopback device
>>> In uts, create "localhost"
>>> Are there examples where we rather inherit ? Filesystem ?
>>
>> Of course filesystem is already implemented, and does inheret a full
>> copy.
>
>
> why do we want to use clone()? Just because of its name and flags?
> I think it is really strange to fork() to create network context. What
> has process creation has to do with it?
>
> After all these clone()'s are called, some management actions from host
> system are still required, to add these IPs/routings/etc.
> So? Why mess it up? Why not create a separate clean interface for
> container management?
>
> Kirill
>

We need a "init" per container, which represents the context of the
system represented by the container.
If that is the case, then why not create the container such that
we specify what namespaces need to be new for a container at
the container creation time and initialize them to a well understood
state that makes sense (e.g. copy namespace (FS, uts) , new fresh state (pid) ).

Then use the standard syscall to modify state (now "virtualized" through
the task->xxx_namespace access ).

Do you see a need to change the namespace of a container after it
has been created. I am not referring to the state of the namespace
but truely moving to a completely different namespace after the
container has been created.

Obviously you seem to have some other usage in mind, beyond what my
limited vision can see. Can you share some of those examples, because
that would help this discussion along ...

Thanks a 10^6.

-- Hubertus

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[Message index]

		[PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: Kirill Korotaev on Mon, 06 February 2006 21:55
		[PATCH 2/4] Virtualization/containers: CONFIG_CONTAINER By: Kirill Korotaev on Mon, 06 February 2006 22:10
		[PATCH 3/4] Virtualization/containers: UID hash By: Kirill Korotaev on Mon, 06 February 2006 22:15
		[PATCH 4/4] Virtualization/containers: uts name By: Kirill Korotaev on Mon, 06 February 2006 22:20
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: Dave Hansen on Mon, 06 February 2006 23:00
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: dev on Tue, 07 February 2006 12:22
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: ebiederm on Tue, 07 February 2006 03:34
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: Rik van Riel on Tue, 07 February 2006 03:40
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: Sam Vilain on Tue, 07 February 2006 06:30
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: dev on Tue, 07 February 2006 11:49
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: ebiederm on Tue, 07 February 2006 14:31
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: ebiederm on Tue, 07 February 2006 15:42
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: dev on Tue, 07 February 2006 16:16
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: ebiederm on Tue, 07 February 2006 17:20
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: Sam Vilain on Tue, 07 February 2006 22:43
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: Hubertus Franke on Tue, 07 February 2006 16:57
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: serue on Tue, 07 February 2006 20:19
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: Hubertus Franke on Tue, 07 February 2006 20:46
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: ebiederm on Tue, 07 February 2006 22:00
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: Hubertus Franke on Tue, 07 February 2006 22:19
		The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: ebiederm on Tue, 07 February 2006 22:06
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: Hubertus Franke on Tue, 07 February 2006 23:35
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: Alexey Kuznetsov on Wed, 08 February 2006 00:43
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: ebiederm on Wed, 08 February 2006 02:49
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: serue on Wed, 08 February 2006 03:36
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: ebiederm on Wed, 08 February 2006 05:23
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: Hubertus Franke on Wed, 08 February 2006 14:40
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: ebiederm on Wed, 08 February 2006 17:46
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: ebiederm on Wed, 08 February 2006 22:28
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: serue on Wed, 08 February 2006 15:17
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: serue on Wed, 08 February 2006 18:03
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: dev on Mon, 20 February 2006 12:08
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: Herbert Poetzl on Mon, 20 February 2006 12:40
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: dev on Mon, 20 February 2006 14:25
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: Herbert Poetzl on Mon, 20 February 2006 15:16
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: Andi Kleen on Mon, 20 February 2006 15:17
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: ebiederm on Wed, 08 February 2006 03:52
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: Herbert Poetzl on Wed, 08 February 2006 04:37
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: ebiederm on Wed, 08 February 2006 04:46
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: Herbert Poetzl on Wed, 08 February 2006 04:56
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: serue on Wed, 08 February 2006 14:38
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: Hubertus Franke on Wed, 08 February 2006 14:51
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: dev on Wed, 08 February 2006 15:34
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: Hubertus Franke on Wed, 08 February 2006 15:57
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: Herbert Poetzl on Wed, 08 February 2006 19:02
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: ebiederm on Wed, 08 February 2006 16:48
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: Hubertus Franke on Wed, 08 February 2006 18:31
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: Dave Hansen on Wed, 08 February 2006 20:21
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: serue on Wed, 08 February 2006 21:22
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: ebiederm on Thu, 09 February 2006 05:41
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: Kyle Moffett on Thu, 09 February 2006 04:45
		Re: The issues for agreeing on a virtualization/namespaces implementation. By: ebiederm on Thu, 09 February 2006 22:25
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: Sam Vilain on Tue, 07 February 2006 22:58
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: Hubertus Franke on Tue, 07 February 2006 23:18
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: ebiederm on Wed, 08 February 2006 05:03
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: Hubertus Franke on Wed, 08 February 2006 14:13
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: dev on Wed, 08 February 2006 15:42
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: ebiederm on Wed, 08 February 2006 16:39
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: Kevin Fox on Wed, 08 February 2006 02:08
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: dev on Wed, 08 February 2006 15:35
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: ebiederm on Wed, 08 February 2006 17:16
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: Dave Hansen on Wed, 08 February 2006 20:43
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: ebiederm on Wed, 08 February 2006 21:04
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: dev on Tue, 07 February 2006 12:12
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: ebiederm on Tue, 07 February 2006 14:06
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: Rik van Riel on Tue, 07 February 2006 14:52
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: ebiederm on Tue, 07 February 2006 15:13
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: Sam Vilain on Wed, 08 February 2006 01:16
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: Paul Jackson on Wed, 08 February 2006 04:21
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: ebiederm on Thu, 09 February 2006 00:24
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: Jeff Dike on Thu, 09 February 2006 02:18
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: ebiederm on Thu, 09 February 2006 03:16
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: Hubertus Franke on Thu, 09 February 2006 16:38
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: Jeff Dike on Thu, 09 February 2006 17:47
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: Sam Vilain on Thu, 09 February 2006 22:09
		Re: [PATCH 1/4] Virtualization/containers: introduction By: ebiederm on Thu, 09 February 2006 21:56

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