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Re: Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core [message #11085 is a reply to message #11083]

Tue, 13 March 2007 10:49

Andrew Morton
Messages: 127
Registered: December 2005

Senior Member

> On Tue, 13 Mar 2007 13:19:53 +0300 Kirill Korotaev <dev@sw.ru> wrote:
> Andrew Morton wrote:
> >>>> - shared mappings of 'shared' files (binaries
> >>>> and libraries) to allow for reduced memory
> >>>> footprint when N identical guests are running
> >>>
> >>>So, it sounds like this can be phrased as a requirement like:
> >>>
> >>> "Guests must be able to share pages."
> >>>
> >>>Can you give us an idea why this is so?
> >>
> >>sure, one reason for this is that guests tend to
> >>be similar (or almost identical) which results
> >>in quite a lot of 'shared' libraries and executables
> >>which would otherwise get cached for each guest and
> >>would also be mapped for each guest separately
> >
> >
> > nooooooo. What you're saying there amounts to text replication. There is
> > no proposal here to create duplicated copies of pagecache pages: the VM
> > just doesn't support that (Nick has soe protopatches which do this as a
> > possible NUMA optimisation).
> >
> > So these mmapped pages will contiue to be shared across all guests. The
> > problem boils down to "which guest(s) get charged for each shared page".
> >
> > A simple and obvious and easy-to-implement answer is "the guest which paged
> > it in". I think we should firstly explain why that is insufficient.
> I guess by "paged it in" you essentially mean
> "mapped the page into address space for the *first* time"?

Not really - I mean "first allocated the page". ie: major fault(), read(),
write(), etc.

> i.e. how many times the same page mapped into 2 address spaces
> in the same container should be accounted for?
>
> We believe ONE. It is better due to:
> - it allows better estimate how much RAM container uses.
> - if one container mapped a single page 10,000 times,
> it doesn't mean it is worse than a container which mapped only 200 pages
> and that it should be killed in case of OOM.

I'm not sure that we need to account for pages at all, nor care about rss.

If we use a physical zone-based containment scheme: fake-numa,
variable-sized zones, etc then it all becomes moot. You set up a container
which has 1.5GB of physial memory then toss processes into it. As that
process set increases in size it will toss out stray pages which shouldn't
be there, then it will start reclaiming and swapping out its own pages and
eventually it'll get an oom-killing.

No RSS acounting or page acounting in sight, because we already *have* that
stuff, at the physical level, in the zone.

Overcommitment can be performed by allowing different containers to share
the same zone set, or by dynamically increasing or decreasing the size of
a physical container.

This all works today with fake-numa and cpusets, no kernel changes needed.

It could be made to work fairly simply with a multi-zone approach, or with
resizeable zones.

I'd be interested in knowing what you think the shortcomings of this are
likely to be,.

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[Message index]

		[RFC][PATCH 0/7] Resource controllers based on process containers By: xemul on Tue, 06 March 2007 14:42
		[RFC][PATCH 1/7] Resource counters By: xemul on Tue, 06 March 2007 14:47
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 1/7] Resource counters By: Balbir Singh on Wed, 07 March 2007 04:03
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 1/7] Resource counters By: xemul on Wed, 07 March 2007 07:17
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 1/7] Resource counters By: Herbert Poetzl on Fri, 09 March 2007 16:37
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 1/7] Resource counters By: xemul on Sun, 11 March 2007 09:01
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 1/7] Resource counters By: ebiederm on Sun, 11 March 2007 19:00
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 1/7] Resource counters By: Herbert Poetzl on Mon, 12 March 2007 01:16
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 1/7] Resource counters By: ebiederm on Tue, 13 March 2007 09:09
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 1/7] Resource counters By: xemul on Tue, 13 March 2007 09:27
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 1/7] Resource counters By: Herbert Poetzl on Tue, 13 March 2007 15:21
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 1/7] Resource counters By: xemul on Tue, 13 March 2007 15:41
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 1/7] Resource counters By: Srivatsa Vaddagiri on Tue, 13 March 2007 16:07
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 1/7] Resource counters By: xemul on Wed, 14 March 2007 07:12
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 1/7] Resource counters By: ebiederm on Thu, 15 March 2007 16:51
		Re: Re: [RFC][PATCH 1/7] Resource counters By: dev on Tue, 13 March 2007 09:36
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 1/7] Resource counters By: Herbert Poetzl on Tue, 13 March 2007 16:32
		[RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: xemul on Tue, 06 March 2007 14:53
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Andrew Morton on Tue, 06 March 2007 22:00
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: dev on Sun, 11 March 2007 12:13
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Andrew Morton on Sun, 11 March 2007 12:51
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Balbir Singh on Sun, 11 March 2007 15:51
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: ebiederm on Sun, 11 March 2007 19:34
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Herbert Poetzl on Mon, 12 March 2007 01:00
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Dave Hansen on Mon, 12 March 2007 18:42
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Herbert Poetzl on Mon, 12 March 2007 22:41
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: xemul on Mon, 12 March 2007 09:02
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Herbert Poetzl on Mon, 12 March 2007 21:11
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: xemul on Tue, 13 March 2007 07:17
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Herbert Poetzl on Tue, 13 March 2007 15:05
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: xemul on Tue, 13 March 2007 15:32
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: dev on Tue, 13 March 2007 15:10
		Re: Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Kirill Korotaev on Mon, 12 March 2007 09:10
		Re: Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: ebiederm on Tue, 13 March 2007 09:26
		Re: Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: dev on Tue, 13 March 2007 15:30
		Re: Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: dev on Tue, 13 March 2007 10:06
		Re: Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Andrew Morton on Tue, 13 March 2007 10:49
		Re: Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Herbert Poetzl on Tue, 13 March 2007 14:59
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Dave Hansen on Tue, 13 March 2007 17:05
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: mel on Wed, 14 March 2007 15:38
		Re: Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Paul Menage on Sun, 18 March 2007 22:44
		Re: Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: ebiederm on Mon, 19 March 2007 17:41
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Herbert Poetzl on Fri, 09 March 2007 16:48
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: xemul on Sun, 11 March 2007 09:08
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Herbert Poetzl on Sun, 11 March 2007 14:32
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: xemul on Sun, 11 March 2007 15:04
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Herbert Poetzl on Mon, 12 March 2007 00:41
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: xemul on Mon, 12 March 2007 08:31
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Balbir Singh on Mon, 12 March 2007 09:55
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Herbert Poetzl on Mon, 12 March 2007 23:43
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Balbir Singh on Tue, 13 March 2007 01:57
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Srivatsa Vaddagiri on Tue, 13 March 2007 02:24
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Herbert Poetzl on Tue, 13 March 2007 16:06
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Balbir Singh on Wed, 07 March 2007 05:37
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: xemul on Wed, 07 March 2007 07:25
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Dave Hansen on Mon, 12 March 2007 23:02
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: ebiederm on Sun, 18 March 2007 16:58
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: akpm on Tue, 13 March 2007 06:04
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Dave Hansen on Tue, 13 March 2007 17:26
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Alan Cox on Tue, 13 March 2007 19:09
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: ebiederm on Fri, 16 March 2007 00:55
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Dave Hansen on Fri, 16 March 2007 16:31
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: ebiederm on Fri, 16 March 2007 18:54
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: mel on Wed, 14 March 2007 16:47
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Dave Hansen on Tue, 13 March 2007 20:28
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Herbert Poetzl on Tue, 13 March 2007 15:11
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: dev on Tue, 13 March 2007 15:54
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Dave Hansen on Wed, 14 March 2007 20:42
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: mel on Tue, 20 March 2007 18:57
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Dave Hansen on Fri, 16 March 2007 19:46
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: ebiederm on Sun, 18 March 2007 17:42
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 2/7] RSS controller core By: Herbert Poetzl on Mon, 19 March 2007 15:48
		controlling mmap()'d vs read/write() pages By: Dave Hansen on Tue, 20 March 2007 16:15
		Re: controlling mmap()'d vs read/write() pages By: ebiederm on Tue, 20 March 2007 21:19
		Re: controlling mmap()'d vs read/write() pages By: Herbert Poetzl on Fri, 23 March 2007 00:51
		Re: controlling mmap()'d vs read/write() pages By: Nick Piggin on Fri, 23 March 2007 05:57
		Re: controlling mmap()'d vs read/write() pages By: ebiederm on Fri, 23 March 2007 10:12
		Re: controlling mmap()'d vs read/write() pages By: Dave Hansen on Fri, 23 March 2007 16:41
		Re: controlling mmap()'d vs read/write() pages By: Herbert Poetzl on Fri, 23 March 2007 18:16
		Re: controlling mmap()'d vs read/write() pages By: Balbir Singh on Wed, 28 March 2007 09:18
		Re: controlling mmap()'d vs read/write() pages By: Nick Piggin on Fri, 23 March 2007 10:47
		Re: controlling mmap()'d vs read/write() pages By: ebiederm on Fri, 23 March 2007 12:21
		Re: controlling mmap()'d vs read/write() pages By: Nick Piggin on Wed, 28 March 2007 07:33
		[RFC][PATCH 3/7] Data structures changes for RSS accounting By: xemul on Tue, 06 March 2007 14:55
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 3/7] Data structures changes for RSS accounting By: ebiederm on Sun, 11 March 2007 19:13
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 3/7] Data structures changes for RSS accounting By: dev on Mon, 12 March 2007 16:16
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 3/7] Data structures changes for RSS accounting By: Dave Hansen on Mon, 12 March 2007 16:48
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 3/7] Data structures changes for RSS accounting By: xemul on Mon, 12 March 2007 17:19
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 3/7] Data structures changes for RSS accounting By: Balbir Singh on Mon, 12 March 2007 17:21
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 3/7] Data structures changes for RSS accounting By: Dave Hansen on Mon, 12 March 2007 17:27
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 3/7] Data structures changes for RSS accounting By: xemul on Tue, 13 March 2007 07:10
		[RFC][PATCH 4/7] RSS accounting hooks over the code By: xemul on Tue, 06 March 2007 14:57
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 4/7] RSS accounting hooks over the code By: xemul on Wed, 14 March 2007 15:43
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 4/7] RSS accounting hooks over the code By: Cedric Le Goater on Wed, 14 March 2007 15:37
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 4/7] RSS accounting hooks over the code By: ebiederm on Sun, 11 March 2007 19:14
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 4/7] RSS accounting hooks over the code By: dev on Mon, 12 March 2007 16:23
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 4/7] RSS accounting hooks over the code By: Dave Hansen on Mon, 12 March 2007 16:50
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 4/7] RSS accounting hooks over the code By: dev on Mon, 12 March 2007 17:07
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 4/7] RSS accounting hooks over the code By: Herbert Poetzl on Mon, 12 March 2007 23:54
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 4/7] RSS accounting hooks over the code By: ebiederm on Tue, 13 March 2007 09:58
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 4/7] RSS accounting hooks over the code By: Nick Piggin on Tue, 13 March 2007 10:25
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 4/7] RSS accounting hooks over the code By: Ethan Solomita on Wed, 28 March 2007 20:15
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 4/7] RSS accounting hooks over the code By: Dave Hansen on Mon, 12 March 2007 17:33
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 4/7] RSS accounting hooks over the code By: ebiederm on Tue, 13 March 2007 09:43
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 4/7] RSS accounting hooks over the code By: ebiederm on Tue, 13 March 2007 16:01
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 4/7] RSS accounting hooks over the code By: Nick Piggin on Wed, 14 March 2007 03:51
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 4/7] RSS accounting hooks over the code By: Balbir Singh on Wed, 14 March 2007 06:42
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 4/7] RSS accounting hooks over the code By: Nick Piggin on Wed, 14 March 2007 06:57
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 4/7] RSS accounting hooks over the code By: Balbir Singh on Wed, 14 March 2007 07:48
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 4/7] RSS accounting hooks over the code By: Vaidyanathan Srinivas on Wed, 14 March 2007 13:25
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 4/7] RSS accounting hooks over the code By: Nick Piggin on Wed, 14 March 2007 13:49
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 4/7] RSS accounting hooks over the code By: dev on Wed, 14 March 2007 16:16
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 4/7] RSS accounting hooks over the code By: Nick Piggin on Thu, 15 March 2007 05:01
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 4/7] RSS accounting hooks over the code By: Vaidyanathan Srinivas on Wed, 14 March 2007 14:43
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 4/7] RSS accounting hooks over the code By: Balbir Singh on Thu, 15 March 2007 05:44
		[RFC][PATCH 5/7] Per-container OOM killer and page reclamation By: xemul on Tue, 06 March 2007 15:01
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 5/7] Per-container OOM killer and page reclamation By: Balbir Singh on Fri, 09 March 2007 21:21
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 5/7] Per-container OOM killer and page reclamation By: xemul on Sun, 11 March 2007 08:39
		[RFC][PATCH 6/7] Account for the number of tasks within container By: xemul on Tue, 06 March 2007 15:02
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 6/7] Account for the number of tasks within container By: Paul Menage on Wed, 07 March 2007 02:00
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 6/7] Account for the number of tasks within container By: xemul on Wed, 07 March 2007 07:10
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 6/7] Account for the number of tasks within container By: Paul Menage on Thu, 08 March 2007 13:49
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 6/7] Account for the number of tasks within container By: xemul on Sun, 11 March 2007 08:34
		[RFC][PATCH 7/7] Account for the number of files opened within container By: xemul on Tue, 06 March 2007 15:05
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 0/7] Resource controllers based on process containers By: Paul Menage on Wed, 07 March 2007 02:02
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 0/7] Resource controllers based on process containers By: xemul on Wed, 07 March 2007 07:27
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 0/7] Resource controllers based on process containers By: Balbir Singh on Wed, 07 March 2007 06:52
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 0/7] Resource controllers based on process containers By: xemul on Wed, 07 March 2007 07:30
		Re: [RFC][PATCH 0/7] Resource controllers based on process containers By: dev on Wed, 07 March 2007 09:30

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